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+---- Thread: [Rule] Generators and Minimum Pricing (/showthread.php?tid=5285235)
Generators and Minimum Pricing - Omniscient - May 28, 2016
New rules:
5. No free account giveaways. Market sales only.
6. No account generators.
7. All accounts sold must be priced at a minimum of $1. Bulk sales should still equate to at least $1 per account.
Please adhere asap to these policies. If you have an existing thread please either close it or edit it for compliance.
Thank you.
* - Grammar Rays - May 28, 2016
How should we report existing posts/threads? Marketplace Violation?
Is there perhaps a cooling off period for existing services?
* - Vitani - May 28, 2016
These new rules should get rid of all the 0.01$ NFC sales etc. Nice update Omni. This will probably give serious vendors alot more profit and the NFC market may actually make it's comeback on HF.
* - hey soul sister - May 28, 2016
These updates pretty much killed NFC sales. I have no say in it but I Can see why it is needed.
* - 257207954 - May 28, 2016
(May 28, 2016 02:08 PM)Vitani Wrote: These new rules should get rid of all the 0.01$ NFC sales etc. Nice update Omni. This will probably give serious vendors alot more profit and the NFC market may actually make it's comeback on HF.
Yeah, either come back or completely die. I guess we'll see.
* - Omniscient - May 28, 2016
For people that say this will completely kill the section are wrong.
1. Penny account sales are essentially valueless. They offer no value to the section.
2. Most account sales were higher than a penny and most are $1 or more already.
3. Generators were not that large of a market.
This won't have the negative effects that people think it will to the section. If anything it will increase the value here.
* - william - May 28, 2016
Most people were doing penny sales for rep, I don't see it as a problem, but scammers could potentially build up loads of rep from penny accounts and then exit-scam. Nice addition. :)
* - 帖子作者 - May 28, 2016
No account generators???
I think that might be a mistake, they've been around for a while & have thousands of customers. Not that I used them but I think that's going to hurt a lot of people.
* - Bluffer - May 28, 2016
(May 28, 2016 05:40 PM)Scorpi0n Wrote: No account generators???
I think that might be a mistake, they've been around for a while & have thousands of customers. Not that I used them but I think that's going to hurt a lot of people.
I agree 100%, I just hope Omni might reconsider that part at some point.
HF is the only big forum that still allowed generators and now it too has disallowed them, I think that made HF unique in a way.
I am very disappointed with this decision and I'm sure many others are as well.
I do however think Omni made the decision while keeping the users in mind, so even though I don't like the decision I respect it.
For my generator I really don't know what this will mean, might be the end of it which would really suck, but also it might be time for me to move onto a new product here.
(Posting that here because my thread is closed)
* - Vxncent - May 28, 2016
(May 28, 2016 05:40 PM)Scorpi0n Wrote: No account generators???
I think that might be a mistake, they've been around for a while & have thousands of customers. Not that I used them but I think that's going to hurt a lot of people.
I'm probably wrong but if you can't sell them in this section, can you not just sell them in Premium Sellers/Secondary Sellers (the generators)?
* - Niko - May 28, 2016
I can see this killing all the bigger vendors, but can also see this bringing a lot more individuals to the market to sell their accounts.
* - Bluffer - May 28, 2016
(May 28, 2016 05:55 PM)_Kaye Wrote: I'm probably wrong but if you can't sell them in this section, can you not just sell them in Premium Sellers/Secondary Sellers (the generators)?
Generators are now banned site-wide as of today. They are now on the Disallowed BlackHat Activity Help Document.
* - `Xez - May 28, 2016
(May 28, 2016 03:46 PM)Omniscient Wrote: For people that say this will completely kill the section are wrong.
1. Penny account sales are essentially valueless. They offer no value to the section.
2. Most account sales were higher than a penny and most are $1 or more already.
3. Generators were not that large of a market.
This won't have the negative effects that people think it will to the section. If anything it will increase the value here.
I'd like to refute some of the points you have made so far as I do believe killing off account generators will have a negative effect on the section.
While there were are not that many account generators (4-5), I believe we do in fact represent a large section of the market. Here are some stats based on just the two largest account generators (HyperGen (mine) and accountgen (Bluffer's):
HyperGen Registered Users: 24584
AccountGen Registered Users: 7815
Combined Registered Users: 32399
HyperGen Active Subscriptions: 2861
AccountGen Active Subscriptions: 1461
Combined Active Subscriptions: 4322
Both sales threads are also in the top 10 most replied threads in the section with over 1400 posts in each sales thread.
I think the stats above would indicate that account generators definitely have a large share of the market, and account of a decent percentage of sales in the section once penny account and such are removed.
The other problem I see with banning account generators relates to the core business model. For a generator to be successful, it needs to have a constant flow of incoming sales, so that the profit can be reinvested into more accounts to be added to the generator. If you implement the rules banning account generators, the flow of sales would be cut to almost none, creating a situation where the owner were having to provide accounts to thousands of users every day, but with no profit in return. This usually means that the generator closes down and all of the members lose what the paid for as it becomes unsustainable.
The result would be thousands of annoyed customers.
In regards to the to the line added to the disallowed blackhat activity:
Quote:Account Generators
We do not allow the sale of account generators. These mainly use combo lists and dumps as their primary function for output. Account Generators also conflict with other site policies regarding our NFA (Non-Free Accounts) pricing minimums.
In order to prevent people from abusing our service to make combolist or create large dumps, we have a generation limit of 40 accounts per day in place. This limits people's ability to abuse these dumps on a large scale.
Accounts generators also sold well above the $1, and while I understand that the individual accounts vs price is below $1, there has not been any cases thus far where a generator has been so cheap that it would be useful to boost one's reputation.
In closing, while I understand that this is your forum and you do what you believe is best, I would urge you to reconsider your blanket ban on account generators.
Thanks for you time,
Xez
* - Bluffer - May 28, 2016
Although Xez said it best I must second what he said, this is going to affect HF users more than you may think.
People pay for access to the generator, when I have no where else to sell it the income flow stops, and then I don't have much choice but to shut it down which means a lot of unhappy HF users.
Hackforums has been unique by being one of the very few websites that allows account generators and I think it should remain that way.
You said it yourself Omni, the market for generators just isn't that big, there is not many sellers but there is many many users (majority of which are HF users).
So without continuing too much would it be possible to allow account generators but with some restrictions attached? Like Xez said there are ways around the combo dump issue, we can limit what we allow our users to generate per a day and if you were to add some rules to that I'm sure somebody would report it if it were violated.
Kind Regards,
Bluffer™
Bluffer™
* - Omniscient - May 29, 2016
@Xez and @Bluffer™...
This thread is to notify you of the new policies. It's not to argue any points about them.
Thank you.