[Biariuakbar]

Gun laws are complete trash. In Illinois/California (and many other states) you can't buy toy guns, even ones that are shitty 6 foot long muskets with orange tubes at the end.


IF someone wants to shoot up my school with a musket, feel free.

[DrDoof]

1. Mass shootings are generally committed with an AR rifle.

2. The Las Vegas shooting which is now the worst in US history was carried out an AR with a bump stock.

1. Mass shootings (3+ dead or wounded) are what, 2% of murders? Of the 29 deadliest mass shootings in US history 48% was fully or partly committed with a rifle, 69% fully or partly committed with a pistol or revolver, 41% committed with only pistols or revolvers and 17% committed with only rifles. 79% of shootings with rifles were with AR rifles.

Out of the 29 deadliest mass shootings in US history,
- 48% were fully or partly committed with rifles (79% of shootings with rifles were with AR rifles)
- 69% were fully or partly committed with pistols or revolvers
- 17% were committed with only rifles
- 41% were committed with only pistols or revolvers

...and out of the 501 killed in those shootings,
- 59% were in shootings fully or partly committed with rifles
- 41% were in shootings fully or partly committed with pistols or revolvers
- 16% were in shootings committed with only rifles
- 35% were in shootings committed with only pistols or revolvers

Conclusion: rifles are probably deadlier (when they are used), but it is not by a huge margin if they are. If all mass shootings are reflective of the 29 deadliest then they are not "generally committed with an AR rifle." If rifles are deadlier than handguns then it is safe to assume rifles are more common in the 29 deadliest shootings than less deadly shootings, making the previous statement even more accurate.

2. The Las Vegas shooting was disgustingly evil and horrendous, but it was only one shooting, with few victims in the grand scheme of things. If there's a will there's a way, as shown by truck attacks and airplane hijackings.

High capacity magazines are involved in 50% of shootings and is next up to be struck. Then what? Suppressors? Sights? Rifles? Semi-automatic guns? I don't care about bump stocks, and apart from looking like they are a freakin fun time to use I doubt many people feel they absolutely need them, but getting accustomed with banning things without absolute necessity is dangerous and paves the path for a more authoritarian future.

[CueBasE]

1. Mass shootings (3+ dead or wounded) are what, 2% of murders? Of the 29 deadliest mass shootings in US history 48% was fully or partly committed with a rifle, 69% fully or partly committed with a pistol or revolver, 41% committed with only pistols or revolvers and 17% committed with only rifles. 79% of shootings with rifles were with AR rifles.

Out of the 29 deadliest mass shootings in US history,
- 48% were fully or partly committed with rifles (79% of shootings with rifles were with AR rifles)
- 69% were fully or partly committed with pistols or revolvers
- 17% were committed with only rifles
- 41% were committed with only pistols or revolvers

...and out of the 501 killed in those shootings,
- 59% were in shootings fully or partly committed with rifles
- 41% were in shootings fully or partly committed with pistols or revolvers
- 16% were in shootings committed with only rifles
- 35% were in shootings committed with only pistols or revolvers

Conclusion: rifles are probably deadlier (when they are used), but it is not by a huge margin if they are. If all mass shootings are reflective of the 29 deadliest then they are not "generally committed with an AR rifle." If rifles are deadlier than handguns then it is safe to assume rifles are more common in the 29 deadliest shootings than less deadly shootings, making the previous statement even more accurate.

2. The Las Vegas shooting was disgustingly evil and horrendous, but it was only one shooting, with few victims in the grand scheme of things. If there's a will there's a way, as shown by truck attacks and airplane hijackings.

High capacity magazines are involved in 50% of shootings and is next up to be struck. Then what? Suppressors? Sights? Rifles? Semi-automatic guns? I don't care about bump stocks, and apart from looking like they are a freakin fun time to use I doubt many people feel they absolutely need them, but getting accustomed with banning things without absolute necessity is dangerous and paves the path for a more authoritarian future.

You’re missing the point. You said it yourself, rifles are deadlier. Boom end of discussion, that’s why they are trying to ban them. It’s not about the death toll vs pistols.

Listen I worked in law enforcement, I wore a level 3A vest that would stop up to a .44 mag and 12 gauge shotgun. A rifle would go right through it like butter. So you must actually understand how deadly of a weapon an AR can be.

[Bill Gates]

I had a friend show me these a month ago, I argued that it's surely illegal and will get banned, he argued otherwise. Thanks, OP I'll now get to rag on him.

[DrDoof]

You’re missing the point.  You said it yourself, rifles are deadlier.  Boom end of discussion, that’s why they are trying to ban them.  It’s not about the death toll vs pistols.

Listen I worked in law enforcement, I wore a level 3A vest that would stop up to a .44 mag and 12 gauge shotgun.  A rifle would go right through it like butter.  So you must actually understand how deadly of a weapon an AR can be.

But that makes no sense? Americans are stereotypically stupid but they can't be that dense? Of course the rifle is way more deadly when shot, and probably more deadly when used in a mass shooting (more deaths), but how can that be the focus? Why is decreasing the deaths per incident more important than increasing the total deaths? Wtf?

Since you were law enforcement, how often are bump stocks used by criminals?

[Leroy Jethro Gibbs]

But that makes no sense? Americans are stereotypically stupid but they can't be that dense? Of course the rifle is way more deadly when shot, and probably more deadly when used in a mass shooting (more deaths), but how can that be the focus? Why is decreasing the deaths per incident more important than increasing the total deaths? Wtf?

Since you were law enforcement, how often are bump stocks used by criminals?

Also how often were the firearms related to crimes actually legally owned.

[CueBasE]

But that makes no sense? Americans are stereotypically stupid but they can't be that dense? Of course the rifle is way more deadly when shot, and probably more deadly when used in a mass shooting (more deaths), but how can that be the focus? Why is decreasing the deaths per incident more important than increasing the total deaths? Wtf?

Since you were law enforcement, how often are bump stocks used by criminals?

I’m not speaking on behalf of the United States by any means. Yes it is stupid but this is a problem that I believe steams from the our constitutional right to own guns.
We don’t actually need them.

Now people argue blah blah blah the black market and criminals will still get guns.

That problem comes from corruption with the gun manufacturers. Somewhere between the manufacture and the seller, someone is scratching off serial numbers or perhaps the manufacturer never put them on. You fix that problem then you’ve cut off the source for bad guys to get guns.

[DrDoof]

I’m not speaking on behalf of the United States by any means.  Yes it is stupid but this is a problem that I believe steams from the our constitutional right to own guns.  
We don’t actually need them.

Now people argue blah blah blah the black market and criminals will still get guns.

That problem comes from corruption with the gun manufacturers.  Somewhere between the manufacture and the seller, someone is scratching off serial numbers or perhaps the manufacturer never put them on.  You fix that problem then you’ve cut off the source for bad guys to get guns.

Then again you guys have 400 times more gangs than any other civilized country. 1.5-3 million instances of citizens protecting themselves with guns versus 30 k deaths say guns do serve some kind of a valid purpose... Fix the corruption problem (if that is a problem) and then remove the guns from law abiding citizens, not the other way around, lmao.

Those who want to kill will always kill, it is insane to think you can outrun the inevitable with laws and bans. The once greatest nation on the planet will start banning kitchen knife like the UK eventually if this keeps up.

[Leroy Jethro Gibbs]

I’m not speaking on behalf of the United States by any means. Yes it is stupid but this is a problem that I believe steams from the our constitutional right to own guns.
We don’t actually need them.

Now people argue blah blah blah the black market and criminals will still get guns.

That problem comes from corruption with the gun manufacturers. Somewhere between the manufacture and the seller, someone is scratching off serial numbers or perhaps the manufacturer never put them on. You fix that problem then you’ve cut off the source for bad guys to get guns.

Kinda hard to prevent criminals from getting guns when your own government gives them guns.

[CueBasE]

Kinda hard to prevent criminals from getting guns when your own government gives them guns.

So do you see the problem?

Gun manufactures are in bed with the NRA who is in bed with the government. They allow guns to end up on the street illegally which leads to criminals going to jail. The government makes money off of citizens taxes to operate the jail.

Its a never ending cycle.

[Leroy Jethro Gibbs]

So do you see the problem?

Gun manufactures are in bed with the NRA who is in bed with the government. They allow guns to end up on the street illegally which leads to criminals going to jail. The government makes money off of citizens taxes to operate the jail.

Its a never ending cycle.

Thats a huge rabbit hole to deep dive so hard into.

[C0000000000000N]

Maybe ya'll stop shooting up clubs and festivals now.

qq

[The_Right_Stuff]

Ok, when people say AR, they generally mean assault style weapons which are most commonly chambered in 223/556 like real assault rifles.

The only advantage of an AR chambered in .308 is higher rate of fire and customization.  Therefore its not needed.

Your a fucking retard. You have no idea anything about guns at all.


1) .308 AR15's are LOWER fire rate on average than 5.56.
2) .308 are MORE deadly not less.
3) Assault Style weapon is not a thing no AR15's civilians are buying are "Assault Style"
4) Customization does not make a gun more deadly show me one case where a folding stock & hello kitty sticker on the barrel gassed 6 trillion jews.
5) Ar15's are functionally no different than any hunting rifle.


There has not been a single mass shooting on US soil with an Assault Rifle. There have been mass shootings in Europe with Assault Rifles. Please show me if you find one.


Assault Rifles have been banned for decades and its bullshit that they were due to never being used in crime.

---

So do you see the problem?

Gun manufactures are in bed with the NRA who is in bed with the government.  They allow guns to end up on the street illegally which leads to criminals going to jail.  The government makes money off of citizens taxes to operate the jail.

Its a never ending cycle.

How the fuck does a gun manufacturer benefit from illegal street sales? Don't they want people buying new guns rather than the same gun used in 201 murders?

Also the NRA are fucking cucks they supported the federal background checks that are unconstitutional, bump stock bans, assault rifle ban, etc.

---

1. Mass shootings are generally committed with an AR rifle.

2. The Las Vegas shooting which is now the worst in US history was carried out an AR with a bump stock.

1) More mass shootings are committed with Handguns than Rifles
1B) AR15's are used in very few media reports shotguns as fucking AR's.

2)Actually most of the kills were with his other gun that didn't have a bumpstock on it because he couldn't handle the bump stock rifle. He also had an illegally modified full auto rifle but that wasn't used either.

---

Then again you guys have 400 times more gangs than any other civilized country. 1.5-3 million instances of citizens protecting themselves with guns versus 30 k deaths say guns do serve some kind of a valid purpose... Fix the corruption problem (if that is a problem) and then remove the guns from law abiding citizens, not the other way around, lmao.

Those who want to kill will always kill, it is insane to think you can outrun the inevitable with laws and bans. The once greatest nation on the planet will start banning kitchen knife like the UK eventually if this keeps up.

Only 10k murders in USA each year about 8k by guns 50% of them by blacks. Pretty low murder rate lower than most of the world and no country with higher blacks or Hispanics have crime rates even close to USA.

Now people argue blah blah blah the black market and criminals will still get guns.

Go Ask mexico or any country in South America or even in Europe how well gun bans work. There has not ever in the history of the planet been a single Gun Control measure that actually reduced crime. This is objective fact.

---

 Like I said, I'm very pro gun but I'm also a realist.

Yes it is stupid but this is a problem that I believe steams from the our constitutional right to own guns.
We don’t actually need them.

Dood are you fucking serious. You literally support banning guns, you know nothing about guns, you make up huge lies every post.

You are a fucking joke. You don't even have views your just an NPC parroting CNN. You don't even know what an AR15 is but you think its black and scary and every single post you lie about trying to pretend that you are pro gun while you literally advocate for banning guns.

[CueBasE]

Also how often were the firearms related to crimes actually legally owned.

Your a fucking retard. You have no idea anything about guns at all.


1) .308 AR15's are LOWER fire rate on average than 5.56.
2) .308 are MORE deadly not less.
3) Assault Style weapon is not a thing no AR15's civilians are buying are "Assault Style"
4) Customization does not make a gun more deadly show me one case where a folding stock & hello kitty sticker on the barrel gassed 6 trillion jews.
5) Ar15's are functionally no different than any hunting rifle.


There has not been a single mass shooting on US soil with an Assault Rifle. There have been mass shootings in Europe with Assault Rifles. Please show me if you find one.


Assault Rifles have been banned for decades and its bullshit that they were due to never being used in crime.

---

How the fuck does a gun manufacturer benefit from illegal street sales? Don't they want people buying new guns rather than the same gun used in 201 murders?

Also the NRA are fucking cucks they supported the federal background checks that are unconstitutional, bump stock bans, assault rifle ban, etc.

---

1) More mass shootings are committed with Handguns than Rifles
1B) AR15's are used in very few media reports shotguns as fucking AR's.

2)Actually most of the kills were with his other gun that didn't have a bumpstock on it because he couldn't handle the bump stock rifle. He also had an illegally modified full auto rifle but that wasn't used either.

---

Only 10k murders in USA each year about 8k by guns 50% of them by blacks.  Pretty low murder rate lower than most of the world and no country with higher blacks or Hispanics have crime rates even close to USA.



Go Ask mexico or any country in South America or even in Europe how well gun bans work. There has not ever in the history of the planet been a single Gun Control measure that actually reduced crime. This is objective fact.

---

Dood are you fucking serious. You literally support banning guns, you know nothing about guns, you make up huge lies every post.

You are a fucking joke. You don't even have views your just an NPC parroting CNN. You don't even know what an AR15 is but you think its black and scary and every single post you lie about trying to pretend that you are pro gun while you literally advocate for banning guns.

Learn how to read before commenting and calling someone stupid.  

I never said any specific caliber is more deadly than another.  I mentioned AR style weapons are capable of higher rates of fire due to the design and readiness of aftermarket custom parts.

You brought Asault Rifles into the conversation,  not me.  An AR isn’t an Asault Rifle.

I could go on and discus this with you if you were civil, but instead you presented yourself as an ignorant redneck who probably drives a shitty lifted truck with camo seat covers and lives in a house that smells like wet dog.

[The_Right_Stuff]

I never said any specific caliber is more deadly than another.  I mentioned AR style weapons are capable of higher rates of fire due to the design and readiness of aftermarket custom parts.

Except

1) You claimed .308 were higher fire rates
2) Fire rates will have no difference on an AR15 as its a semi auto
3) You litterally claimed .223 are more deadly

You brought Asault Rifles into the conversation,  not me.  An AR isn’t an Asault Rifle.

You actually called the AR15 "assault style"

I could go on and discus this with you if you were civil, but instead you presented yourself as an ignorant redneck who probably drives a shitty lifted truck with camo seat covers and lives in a house that smells like wet dog.

No you can't you ignored 90% of my post and replied to 10% of it and were still wrong. You are a liar. You are not arguing in good faith every single post you made you LIED you are just spamming out lies just trying to get people to hate guns.

You literally called yourself pro gun while saying people having a right to own guns is stupid.