[ShinsekaiCorp]

TC discord deleted, website deleted, devs got arrested.

Heres my question: although i believe TC didnt have any bad intentions in context of to help people launder money, how come the government can that easily shut down ANY crypto/nft if they really want to?

What exactly is "decentralized" here...?

TC was not made for money laundering, just like onlyfans wasnt made to be pornographic website - the Users are the ones who determined its fate.

If TC had a way to block illegal transactions, then that would be a web2 company and not web3.

And now when TC doesnt block illegal transactions in order to remain "decentralized" and "anonymous", they got arrested and their system got shut down. Ironically, so much for "anonymity" and "decentralization"...

This means the government is able to shut down absolutely any and every crypto, including BTC if they really wanted to. The question now remains is: why are they letting it roll and not shut down the whole of crypto?

What if crypto was a part of the governments plan for a future financial world where they can control, freeze, block or shut down our finances with a click of a button just as easily as they arrested TC founders?

[flyingduck]

damn. i wonder how they found out who they are?!

[PR1V473]

What if crypto was a part of the governments plan for a future financial world where they can control, freeze, block or shut down our finances with a click of a button just as easily as they arrested TC founders?

This got me thinking real hard about possible scenarios...

[P1R4T3]

Do they got arrested???? What was the reason? Money laundering?

[Average HF User]

Seems like you have a poor understanding of how crypto works if you think that shutting down Tornado Cash is shutting down crypto. In fact, Tornado Cash is not even shut down. If you have ever forked the TC repo, you can simply run their site locally, and their smart contract is decentralized and still getting used hundreds of times per day. The problem is government sanctions, but, realistically, all you need to do is find a non-kyc or sanction ignored exchange to provide ETH>XMR movements.

damn. i wonder how they found out who they are?!

As for this, I contributed to Tornado Cash a little bit on GitHub a few months ago, not enough contribution to be notable though. I did notice, however, that all of the main Devs had their personal info plastered all over their GitHub profiles... so it wasn't like they were trying to remain anonymous. Github would probably readily shill their user's personal info to the government anyways.

[ShinsekaiCorp]

Seems like you have a poor understanding of how crypto works if you think that shutting down Tornado Cash is shutting down crypto. In fact, Tornado Cash is not even shut down. If you have ever forked the TC repo, you can simply run their site locally, and their smart contract is decentralized and still getting used hundreds of times per day. The problem is government sanctions, but, realistically, all you need to do is find a non-kyc or sanction ignored exchange to provide ETH>XMR movements.


As for this, I contributed to Tornado Cash a little bit on GitHub a few months ago, not enough contribution to be notable though. I did notice, however, that all of the main Devs had their personal info plastered all over their GitHub profiles... so it wasn't like they were trying to remain anonymous. Github would probably readily shill their user's personal info to the government anyways.

Does that mean if i fork their repo and run TC locally am i also risking to be arrested if i try to withdraw funds from it?

[P1R4T3]

After googling, it's not dev's but dev. One dude, "He is suspected of involvement in concealing criminal financial flows and facilitating money laundering through the mixing of cryptocurrencies through the decentralized Ethereum mixing service Tornado Cash,"
And he will go free, I am 90% sure, it's not his fault how users use his platform... It's like blaming Mark for the user who uploaded porn on Facebook

[Average HF User]

Does that mean if i fork their repo and run TC locally am i also risking to be arrested if i try to withdraw funds from it?

Running the fork locally just gives you a convenient way to interact with the smart contract. Running their site is not going to get you in to trouble, using the smart contract which is sanctioned might. Realistically you are not going to be at risk of arrest unless you happen to be moving large sums of money through tornado cash. There are still hundreds if not thousands of transactions with the smart contract everyday so the sample size is only getting larger.

[Average HF User]

No, it's getting smaller, unfortunately:  https://twitter.com/BotTornado

Damn intersting, I will admit that claim was based off of me looking at ethscan for like 1.3 seconds and seeing like ~20 transactions in an hour and assuming the rest. It's also interesting that people are deciding to move so much money through when there is so little traffic with the smart contract, doesn't seem worth it to me

[Omniscient]

I'd like to see the exact charges and the jurisdiction. And an arrest is not a conviction. But a headline can be nearly as effective.

https://www.coindesk.com/layer2/2022/08/...-you-next/

So he's not technically charged with coding or running the mixer service. It's more about an allegation of actual money laundering.

Also note this little tidbit in the article...

(The difference between Tornado and Helix or Bitcoin Fog is that the latter two were “custodial,” meaning they took possession of users’ funds – a distinction that may no longer matter when it comes to facilitating money laundering or operating a money transmitter.

This is why HF can NEVER EVER have an escrow service where we are custodians of funds potentially used in some illicit manner. People just don't understand that huge distinction.

[ep1capple]

what they're really doing is trying to make an example out of him and signal the start of a more compliant crypto infrastructure rather than true decentralization. A lot of shit is unfolding and at a quick pace hard to keep up lmaoo.

[Omniscient]

what they're really doing is trying to make an example out of him and signal the start of a more compliant crypto infrastructure rather than true decentralization. A lot of shit is unfolding and at a quick pace hard to keep up lmaoo.

Bitcoin is "true decentralization". There is no one to arrest. Regulatory compliance will ultimately fail because of decentralization and open source. Making something illegal doesn't actually work to stop it. Otherwise no one would do drugs or rob banks. And when something is illegal but it's not harmful, eventually it's legal.

The good news is that crypto isn't illegal to begin with. They are gonna try to regulate it, but they can't and in the end their empires of printed money will have to find new forms of power. Like using Carbon Credits or ESG. But we're close to being free from the chains of government fiat.

[Aussie]

Are there are there legal grounds for arresting someone who wrote open source code that was used maliciously by bad actors?

Just checked with my law student friend, the courts would have to prove "he created it with the intention it was going to be used by a bad actor."

[diesiel]

Are there are there legal grounds for arresting someone who wrote open source code that was used maliciously by bad actors?

Just checked with my law student friend, the courts would have to prove "he created it with the intention it was going to be used by a bad actor."

Any government can find a reason to arrest you if they want to bad enough. Your interpretation of the letter-of-the-law is of no consequence. Depending on the country, they may not be able to hold you, but they will achieve the goal of scaring copycats at least in the short term.

Freedom is no longer a god given right, but a privilege that can be revoked at any time, even in the so called "Free world".

[Migos]

Protest in Amsterdam for Alex Pertsev:  https://www.theblock.co/post/164657/deve...-amsterdam

there should be more then 50 people in the square ffs.