[l0new0lf]

I've found no evidence supporting the claim primates can smell if you're pregnant.

http://www.babycenter.com/404_can-pets-s...1379572.bc

"We don't have scientific proof that pets sense their owners' pregnancies"

Specifically pets are dogs, dogs smell much better than primates. If a dog cannot smell and determine you are pregnant, what makes you think a monkey can smell and determine that?


I stand by my original assumption that they just read body language well.

I didn't say they did if you'd read my post. I simply said animals are very good with these things [dealing with children was my implication], especially primates. Some animals (not specifically primates, I didn't say that at all) can even detect pregnancies. I was only furthering my point that a lot of animals are universally passive toward children. Hence seeing a lot of incidences where animals will raise other species.

[Jackie Chun]

I didn't say they did if you'd read my post. I simply said animals are very good with these things [dealing with children was my implication], especially primates. Some animals (not specifically primates, I didn't say that at all) can even detect pregnancies. I was only furthering my point that a lot of animals are universally passive toward children. Hence seeing a lot of incidences where animals will raise other species.

That's what was implied because we're not talking about just any animal, we're talking about primates more specifically a gorilla.

You're the one who said no, and attempted to refute my argument that animals specifically primates are able to read body language which could be a reason as to why an ape could tell if someone is impregnate or a non-threat.

[★ TAQ ★]

why not just get rid of zoos. if you want to see animals go to the wild and spectate from afar

They'll become extinct is the only issues imo.

---

This reminds of the lions who were recently shot. It's so sad that people can't have some respect and foresight for these endangered animals... They clearly need to look into the design of their Zoo as well imo.

My thoughts exactly, I was so pissed off after I heard the story.

[bοxxy]

One of many reasons why I don't believe in Zoo's.

[l0new0lf]

That's what was implied because we're not talking about just any animal, we're talking about primates more specifically a gorilla.

No, I don't think that was implied, and if that's what you think then I'm sorry you misinterpreted my statement. I specifically said some animals, and again it was to further my point that a lot of animals are passive and empathetic toward infants/children. If I had meant gorillas specifically, I would have said gorillas specifically.

I said no, because I responded in the context of my statement, which was in reference to the animals that DO detect pregnancies... I'm not going to argue semantics with you, this is hardly relevant to the OT, and I know very well you feed on this kind of thing.

[B‍o‍s‍t‍o‍n]

Harambe was protecting the kid he wasn't even attacking him. This is sad asf

[l0new0lf]

Harambe was protecting the kid he wasn't even attacking him. This is sad asf

I had a similar impression to be honest. It didn't appear to be aggressive behaviour to me, yes a little rough, but that's what happens when you stir the curiosity of a 400lb gorilla. I only wish someone could have found a peaceful solution. :( Charges should be pressed imo, but that wouldn't bring back the gorilla.

[Jackie Chun]

No, I don't think that was implied, and if that's what you think then I'm sorry you misinterpreted my statement. I specifically said some animals, and again it was to further my point that a lot of animals are passive and empathetic toward infants/children. If I had meant gorillas specifically, I would have said gorillas specifically.

I said no, because I responded in the context of my statement, which was in reference to the animals that DO detect pregnancies... I'm not going to argue semantics with you, this is hardly relevant to the OT, and I know very well you feed on this kind of thing.

I understand you said animals, but you are failing to realize I responded to that statement under the context animals are primates. And I explained a reason for why animals could "sense" if someone is pregnant. You literally said no, and attempted to refute that argument by stating: "animals can detect subtle changes in biology such as scent."

I clarified, even dogs cannot smell if someone is pregnant. So you're argument is refuted.

"They don't physically sense an unborn child on another creature, they can just tell by how passive you appear."

That's what I said, under the premise "they" are primates. You're the one who is off topic by speaking about animals in general, when I stayed relevant to the topic by discussing apes.

The point is, primates do not smell if someone is pregnant, and according to my research earlier neither do dogs, which I can safely assume no animal can determine if you are pregnant based on scent. They may be able to tell a pregnant women smells different from other human beings but they have no concept of that human being pregnant which is why she smells different from other human beings. Your original notion that the gorilla may not be hostile because many animals "are smart when it comes to these type of things". I elaborated on that notion under the premise of it being gorillas and stated it was due to body language. You are the one who attempted to refute that, and you were wrong.

[Ha Haaa]

Honestly the gorilla would of killed the kid once he saw him. Much like jumping into a lion den. Lions wouldn't wait to kill.
But the gorilla showed no harm to the kid.
These days we will kill anything if that means leaving a scratch on the kid.

[Jackie Chun]

Honestly the gorilla would of killed the kid once he saw him. Much like jumping into a lion den. Lions wouldn't wait to kill.
But the gorilla showed no harm to the kid.
These days we will kill anything if that means leaving a scratch on the kid.

Lions are aggressive while gorillas are passive, especially in captivity.

Plus the way that kid was crying and how everyone was shouting I'm sure the gorilla understood that it didn't belong there, and was wondering what it is and doing there with it. Which is why it grabbed it.

Lions have actually protect whimpering children, it's thought the whimpers resemble a lion's cub? kitten? not sure what to refer to a baby lion.

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/8305836/ns/wor...ded-lions/

[l0new0lf]

I understand you said animals, but you are failing to realize I responded to that statement under the context animals are primates. And I explained a reason for why animals could "sense" if someone is pregnant. You literally said no, and attempted to refute that argument by stating: "animals can detect subtle changes in biology such as scent."

I clarified, even dogs cannot smell if someone is pregnant. So you're argument is refuted.

"They don't physically sense an unborn child on another creature, they can just tell by how passive you appear."

That's what I said, under the premise "they" are primates. You're the one who is off topic by speaking about animals in general, when I stayed relevant to the topic by discussing apes.

The point is, primates do not smell if someone is pregnant, and according to my research earlier neither do dogs, which I can safely assume no animal can determine if you are pregnant based on scent. They may be able to tell a pregnant women smells different from other human beings but they have no concept of that human being pregnant which is why she smells different from other human beings. Your original notion that the gorilla may not be hostile because many animals "are smart when it comes to these type of things". I elaborated on that notion under the premise of it being gorillas and stated it was due to body language. You are the one who attempted to refute that, and you were wrong.

Yes, domesticated dogs and cats do. As well as many wild cats such as lions and tigers, and potentially more animals with similar sensory systems. Feel free to look it up yourself, but I'm not willing to debate such things as I don't feel it's imperative to this topic... I simply questioned the likelihood of a gorilla acting aggressively toward a child. You took an inference from that post, which was beyond the scope of my argument. Yes, just like you misinterpreted my post, I misinterpreted yours. When you said they cannot detect pregnancies, I replied in relevance to my argument which is some animals do, but not specifically gorillas. I don't know why passivity would indicate pregnancy, but again I'm not arguing this. I refuted the argument that animals cannot detect pregnancies, I did not refute animals ability to interpret body language. That's another ridiculous inference on your part, as animals cannot speak. It goes without saying they communicate by body language. Please don't take my arguments out of context, and please don't attempt to argue with me about things I did not say... I did not say animals do not communicate by body language. I did not say gorillas detect pregnancies.

[Jackie Chun]

Yes, domesticated dogs and cats do. As well as many wild cats such as lions and tigers, and potentially more animals with similar sensory systems. Feel free to look it up yourself, but I'm not willing to debate such things as I don't feel it's imperative to this topic... I simply questioned the likelihood of a gorilla acting aggressively toward a child. You took an inference from that post, which was beyond the scope of my argument. Yes, just like you misinterpreted my post, I misinterpreted yours. When you said they cannot detect pregnancies, I replied in relevance to my argument which is some animals do, but not specifically gorillas. I don't know why passivity would indicate pregnancy, but again I'm not arguing this. I refuted the argument that animals cannot detect pregnancies, I did not refute animals inability to interpret body language. That's another ridiculous inference on your part, as animals cannot speak. It goes without saying they communicate by body language. Please don't take my arguments out of context, and please don't attempt to argue with me about things I did not say... I did not say animals do not communicate by body language. I did not say gorillas detect pregnancies.

You argued animals don't communicate through body language. You said no, then said animals can "detect subtle changes in biology". Which for dogs, is true they can smell if a women is pregnant, but like I clarified they have no concept of what pregnancy is for other animals. Teenage girls aren't buying a dog to make sure they aren't pregnant.

And now you're a strawman, I cited a source stating pets do not know if you are pregnant or not. You are simply telling me animals can sense things they cannot understand. A dog can smell the difference from a pregnant women and a regular women, does that mean he can sense pregnancy? No, it just means he can detect the change in body odor. Which is what that site I linked you too earlier was getting across.

lol they can read body language just like we can but it's their main source of communication like with most animals. They don't physically sense an unborn child on another creature, they can just tell by how passive you appear.

No, animals can detect subtle changes in biology such as scent. Animals don't necessarily possess the same senses as us, or to the same acuity. A lot of animals can identify a pregnant woman by her scent/pheromones.

My argument is primates can tell by body language how you are doing, your argument is animals can smell things... If you shit your pants out of fear an animal may smell your shit but he does not know you are fearful, if you cower an animal can tell by your body language you are fearful to an extent considering they them selfs are not overtaken by fear.

[Revenαnt]

It's horrible that the gorilla was killed, however, if it was your child, what would you want them to do? Nevertheless, they did this to save their ass, they would have been sued for all they are worth if the child was harmed by the animal.

[l0new0lf]

You argued animals don't communicate through body language. You said no, then said animals can "detect subtle changes in biology". Which for dogs, is true they can smell if a women is pregnant, but like I clarified they have no concept of what pregnancy is for other animals. Teenage girls aren't buying a dog to make sure they aren't pregnant.

And now you're a strawman, I cited a source stating pets do not know if you are pregnant or not. You are simply telling me animals can sense things they cannot understand. A dog can smell the difference from a pregnant women and a regular women, does that mean he can sense pregnancy? No, it just means he can detect the change in body odor. Which is what that site I linked you too earlier was getting across.




My argument is primates can tell by body language how you are doing, your argument is animals can smell things... If you shit your pants out of fear an animal may smell your shit but he does not know you are fearful, if you cower an animal can tell by your body language you are fearful to an extent considering they them selfs are not overtaken by fear.

It's not just about the smell, it's also about pheromones, you should probably look into that... How do you know what animals can and cannot understand? You're argument is invalid and I'm not continuing this OT discussion. You can't compare pregnancy to detecting an emotion like fear, those are two very different things.

https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=ch...pheromones

[Jackie Chun]

It's not just about the smell, it's also about pheromones, you should probably look into that... How do you know what animals can and cannot understand? You're argument is invalid and I'm not continuing this OT discussion. You can't compare pregnancy to detecting an emotion like fear, those are two very different things.

https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=ch...pheromones

Do you know what pheromones are? That is literal body producing odor....

I know certain animals don't have object permanence, and It's safe to assume a dog can't think up the concept: this human female is pregnant and will give birth because she smells different than a regular female.

Your argument is if you are pregnant an animal can smell you are pregnant.

My argument in counter to that is if you shit your pants, does that mean an animal can determine you are afraid?

The answer is no, one being because shitting your pants is probably a self defense mechanism to deter predators from eating you. The main being because animals unlike human beings cannot create complex conclusions such as someone shits their self out of fear. Instead they rely much more heavily on body language, which expresses much more effectively you are afraid or you are pregnant.