[i am]

As a new member joining HF it really seems to me like there is punishing over-moderation which is making it more challenging for me to break into this community and contribute. Getting instantly punished with warnings without no way to repeal makes HF feel a little more like Reddit, whereas it otherwise feels like a close-knit hacking marketplace, and instead of teaching a new member like me the rules, it punishes me for making honest mistakes and then restricts me from PMing staff to ask questions so I can learn! My only choice is to take a quiz on a bunch of random rules which don't even clarify why I got warned in the first place. This sort of handling actively dissuades new users from getting invested in the forum and investing in learning the rules. Rather than transforming me into a better user, it's just pissed me off, because it's gotten in the way of me making myself a better user.

Because of this I suggest upgraded users be able to PM staff no matter their warning level. I genuinely want to learn, instead I'm treated like a spammer in spite of being upgraded.

---

I've gotten 4 warnings in my time since joining:


1. One marketplace violation for making a new thread for a bulk discount on a product I'm already offering.

Fair, I didn't know this was against the rules. Deleting the thread and messaging me admittedly would have been more helpful than an instant punishment, but fair.

2. One marketplace violation for giving a vouch without a vouch copy contract. Again, fair, I didn't know this rule.

Neither of these rules were discussed on the quizzes I was given. It was a bunch of random unrelated marketplace shit.

Now for the ones today.

---

I was warned twice in the last 24 hours.
One, for this post I made in an explicit "Shitpost Thread":
https://hackforums.net/showthread.php?ti...id62885669

Spoiler (Click to View)


This is a reference to this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7RgN9ijwE4


Now let's be clear... this post is atrocious and I had it coming.

This one is intentionally low quality as a joke, because it's a Shitpost Thread. Evidently shitposts mean something different here than on imageboards and the old internet where the term originates from.
Lesson learned, I won't make an old fashioned shitpost like this again. Warning system worked fine here.

But I was also warned for this one...



https://hackforums.net/showthread.php?ti...id62885664

If you don't know what I'm referencing here, Descartes is worth knowing about and coined the famous "I think therefore I am", which is actually abridged for the argument:
i) The only thing I know for certain is I have doubt ("I doubt")
ii) Therefore I think
ii) Therefore I am ("I exist in some capacity")

So is my post LQ and worth a punishment limiting my use of the forum?

1. The thread is a philosophical thread asking what we are.
   


2. I answered OP's question with an allusion to the single most well-known philosophical quote of all time, which is also the most famous answer to OP's question about what we are as humans.
   


3. I even made a pun with my own forum name while doing this. I even highlighted it with MyBB with the L33T color lmao.
   

This is basically just a tongue-and-cheek way of saying "I know I exist, and nothing else".

And because I received two warnings, I can't even PM the staff member to appeal it and learn about what I should've done better.
I just have to sit here because I was flagged by someone who interpreted it as "Nonsense" because they're not familiar with "I think therefore I am"/Descartes.
I even had to wait to post this suggestion thread.

---

Now, if I'd not made that shitpost I would've been able to message him... but my point is I'm brand new and still learning, and I would be able to learn the HF rules and integrate with the community better if I could message staff about these things so I can learn. I'm sincerely making an effort to learn and be as HQ as possible.

I'm new here and am still learning the rules (there's a lot...) but if a user is upgraded I think it would make sense for them to be able to PM staff members to repeal the warning, and maybe introduce a different way of appealing these. I've missed out on responding to business messages and making HQ posts because the staff member who warned me didn't understand a philosophy reference and determined my post must be low quality. This whole process doesn't reform me from a LQ user into a HQ one, it makes trying to be HQ more challenging and more hesitant/less likely to contribute. It would be nice to be able to repeal it when the post wasn't even low quality, or at the very least discuss learn why I was warned for it.

[Charlie Sheen]

There's nothing stopping you from directly messaging me. https://hackforums.net/private.php?action=send&uid=123

I revoked your marketplace warning since you now have a contract. The nonsense will go away in 2 days. Read our Help Docs, it's filled with information to prevent situations like this.

[i am]

There's nothing stopping you from directly messaging me. https://hackforums.net/private.php?action=send&uid=123

I revoked your marketplace warning since you now have a contract. The nonsense will go away in 2 days. Read our [url=//hackforums.net/misc.php?action=help]Help Docs[/url], it's filled with information to prevent situations like this.

I tried to, it gave me a restriction error until around 2:50AM. Is there a cutoff for warning level?
Thank you for revoking the marketplace one.

---

I also still don't understand how my "Nonsense" post is nonsense to be honest.

[CL1B]

Seems like you deserved all warnings except for that last one, this could very well because you popped in the moderation panel a lot. Either way in case of errors you can/should contact Staff about it.

One time I got reported for posting something, which some staff member believed was against the rules, warned me for it, but this person that found out that this in fact not against the rules and removed the warning same day.

Communication is key.

Welcome to HF, If it helps you; I had to be warned every now and then too before the rules clicked haha.

[SoulZeh]

So it needs an overhaul because you couldn't follow rules? Most bizarre topic I've seen on here so far..

[i am]

Seems like you deserved all warnings except for that last one, this could very well because you popped in the moderation panel a lot. Either way in case of errors you can/should contact Staff about it.

One time I got reported for posting something, which some staff member believed was against the rules, warned me for it, but this person that found out that this in fact not against the rules and removed the warning same day.

Communication is key.

Welcome to HF, If it helps you; I had to be warned every now and then too before the rules clicked haha.

Thanks man, I'll get the hang of it eventually. Yes I definitely had it coming on some of them lmao.

---

So it needs an overhaul because you couldn't follow rules? Most bizarre topic I've seen on here so far..

I think this will be helpful for you: https://www.readingrockets.org/reading-1...prehension
Paragraphs used to be challenging for me too just keep practicing

[CL1B]

This thread was written very nicely btw.

[Omniscient]

The time you took writing this thread should have been used to go read the Help Docs.

The whole point of the warnings is so that maybe, just maybe, you actually do go and read them. Instead you've chosen to gripe about how things are.

And because I received two warnings, I can't even PM the staff member to appeal it and learn about what I should've done better.

That's because there is no actual appeal process for warnings. The Contact Form is always an option if you want to take your chances contacting me.

Because of this I suggest upgraded users be able to PM staff no matter their warning level.

Also, Convo is an option, while warnings do limit your PM ability, pretty sure you can still send a Convo message. You are l33t so you should have that option.

[Hackers]

I hate every time I have to use a PM instead of Convo, so I'm all for PM restrictions on new users. They seem to be the most likely to use the PM system.
I don't know if a warning is a punishment.

if a staff has to remind you of 3+ rules, don't you think there should be some sort of punishment? You weren't banned, you weren't ridiculed, you were warned and prompted to learn the rules ...

It seems like the system works exactly as designed. You repeatedly ignored rules that you're required to read, and the warning system got your attention.

Question:
If Charlie had instead messaged you with this info, would you have said Yes Sir and never did it again? Or would you have tried to go into a 20 minute debate about each issue?

> I think I know the answer, and that is why warning % works well.

I don't have anything against you personally. Staff doesn't have time to handhold every single user who receives a warning for breaking publicly posted rules.

[Omniscient]

We also adjusted it so most warnings expire fairly quickly resulting in full status again.

[Popular]

So it needs an overhaul because you couldn't follow rules? Most bizarre topic I've seen on here so far..

LOL! Right...? Like come on dude, take that whining elsewhere, this is an amazing community structure when rules are followed.

[i am]

This thread was written very nicely btw.

Thank you!

The time you took writing this thread should have been used to go read the [url=//hackforums.net/misc.php?action=help]Help Docs[/url].

The whole point of the warnings is so that maybe, just maybe, you actually do go and read them. Instead you've chosen to gripe about how things are.


That's because there is no actual appeal process for warnings. The Contact Form is always an option if you want to take your chances contacting me.


Also, Convo is an option, while warnings do limit your PM ability, pretty sure you can still send a Convo message. You are l33t so you should have that option.

We also adjusted it so most warnings expire fairly quickly resulting in full status again.

All fair points. I've fully read them now. Not having warning appeals makes sense, I imagine they would be constantly flooded with BS..., the only frustration I had was in not being able to get a hold of a staff member when I suspected he misinterpreted my post, so knowing about the contact form is good to know, and if I somehow manage to fuck up again after reading the Help Docs fully now, I'll wait around in the convo longer, had the red disconnect symbol and assumed I was blocked.
That warning change sounds nice. I'll do everything in my power to never have to "benefit" from it again lol. Thanks for taking the time to review my suggestion and provide counterpoints, I appreciate it.

I hate every time I have to use a PM instead of Convo, so I'm all for PM restrictions on new users. They seem to be the most likely to use the PM system.
I don't know if a warning is a punishment.

if a staff has to remind you of 3+ rules, don't you think there should be some sort of punishment? You weren't banned, you weren't ridiculed, you were warned and prompted to learn the rules ...

It seems like the system works exactly as designed. You repeatedly ignored rules that you're required to read, and the warning system got your attention.

Question:
If Charlie had instead messaged you with this info, would you have said Yes Sir and never did it again? Or would you have tried to go into a 20 minute debate about each issue?

> I think I know the answer, and that is why warning % works well.

I don't have anything against you personally. Staff doesn't have time to handhold every single user who receives a warning for breaking publicly posted rules.

Fair points. To be clear, I agree with the first three warnings and would say the system worked as intended. And no I'm not interested in a 20 minute conversation about warnings lol, but if a post is misinterpreted and my PM ability is taken away, I wouldn't mind the chance to send a few sentences clarifying the nature of the post, hence the suggestion. I also wouldn't mind getting clarification if it were the case that the staff member didn't misinterpret the post, but just thought it was too vague/cryptic or something. Turns out I could convo anyway.
Omniscient already made it clear he's not interested in a distinct appeal system but that I should be able to convo the staff member regardless (which I didn't realize at the time), so the suggestion is already null as I can contact him and ask for clarification afterall. Thanks for the discussion.

LOL! Right...? Like come on dude, take that whining elsewhere, this is an amazing community structure when rules are followed.

I provided three examples of it working, gave props for it working, and a single example where I believe my post was misinterpreted and I was under the impression I couldn't even contact staff to learn why exactly I was warned (let alone appeal it). I expressed the painpoints from a user's perspective and made a suggestion, because I'm invested in this forum. I never said it was a bad system, and turns out the staff have already implemented measures so that you can contact staff members even if warned with contact form or convos, meaning this "suggestion" already exists.
With all due respect you and the member you're riding not even having the diligence to read the entire post does not invalidate my points. At least read the post and lay out your disagreements like the gentlemen above as opposed to bandwagoning. I would've expected more from someone who literally calls himself "Popular", is an "Ambassador" for The Academy, a group seemingly based around mentoring new members into the community, and has his entire profile being branded around helping new users out lmao.

[SoulZeh]

I think this will be helpful for you: https://www.readingrockets.org/reading-1...prehension
Paragraphs used to be challenging for me too just keep practicing

Get the stick out your arse, you're crying over something that could of been well prevented by reading the rules. You get a welcome message with a link to the rules yet you've clearly ignored them..

Stuck up twat.

[i am]

Get the stick out your arse, you're crying over something that could of been well prevented by reading the rules. You get a welcome message with a link to the rules yet you've clearly ignored them..

Stuck up twat.

Lmao the more you cry the more clear it is you still haven't managed to focus long enough to read my post. Name call and throw internet points around all you want, it doesn't change you're a dipshit who can't even read a few paragraphs and formulate a point before insulting someone. 🤣

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Seeing as Omniscient has already addressed this, and that my suggestion to be able to contact staff with warning level already exists, there's no real point to leave this open, especially seeing how disingenuous children are beginning to derail it.
Thanks for taking the time to read my post and for the discussion!